After losing their son Matthew, Norm Ornstein and Judy Harris made a choice that would change thousands of lives. In this episode, they share the story behind the Matthew Harris Ornstein Memorial Foundation—an operating foundation that runs a free summer debate institute for underserved students AND is reforming how the justice system treats serious brain disease.

Norm and Judy talk with Quanda and Meredith about:

• Why they chose an operating foundation over traditional giving

• The debate institute that achieved 100% high school graduation rates (vs. 60% district average)

• Their work to change how doctors and courts treat serious mental illness

• What it means to build something living from loss